SSR > Deemer in terms of skill. Deemer's pretty much fire and forget. The only skill you could add is the skill in moving the secondary to avoid getting shot down.
SSR you at least have to aim d=P
redeemer or super shock: using which takes more skill?
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i will give my view on which is more skillful to use tomorrow in detailed support of my opinion.
but just to add this for von and dia's sake...i am not against or upset at your deemer use except on those little confined maps. its just so hard to see and keep my game somewhat running smooth
i hate flare for rl even if it is strong and good to use, its just annoying playing and seeing mainly nothing but that white-blue most of the time. and it hurts my eyes *,,*
but just to add this for von and dia's sake...i am not against or upset at your deemer use except on those little confined maps. its just so hard to see and keep my game somewhat running smooth
i hate flare for rl even if it is strong and good to use, its just annoying playing and seeing mainly nothing but that white-blue most of the time. and it hurts my eyes *,,*
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TheSynGame
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Crazy_Barks
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i know im gonna get looka at funny for this but the deemer does require more skill becase if you dont know how to make it fire one shot right after the other (like me(how do they do that?)). this is why i like ssr it doesnt requre that much skill its even easier on bigger maps because the monsters dont even see it comeing. also ssr is better for noobs because it will levels em up faster also deemer doesent blow the boddies into bite sized bits =)
My mind works in mysterious ways.
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TheSynGame
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you are right....it does make u look funny. SSR requires precision. I happen to be good with it cause I am an IG/TAM player so knowing DM types helps A LOT.Crazy_Barks wrote:i know im gonna get looka at funny for this but the deemer does require more skill becase if you dont know how to make it fire one shot right after the other (like me(how do they do that?)). this is why i like ssr it doesnt requre that much skill its even easier on bigger maps because the monsters dont even see it comeing. also ssr is better for noobs because it will levels em up faster also deemer doesent blow the boddies into bite sized bits =)
Well, lets go into a bit more details.
I say they both require skill beyond that of a normal player....heres why.
Super shock rifle - Small AOE, which requires precisional aim. You can run around shootin all you want but your not gonna kill anything unless your aiming for it, aside from titans and queens, and then at long range, even they can prove to be hard to hit. Specially for us who play in 3rd person view. Another note is that you can't vamp, blue, or gold them, so if your wopless, then you have to be on extra alert as far as wands and titans go, and without a Protection 5, on all level players, damage just seems to rack up, killing even the highest lvl of players at times.
While...
Redeemer - requires mainly the skill of staying alive. Sure, you can fire and forget it(assuming you have superforce on) But it can still be shot down. Big or small maps, when surrounded, or not, hitting yourself doesn't feel as good as not vamping either. Not to mention the slow firing rate whether you end up having to continually switch to the redeemer after every fire, or your able to keep it loaded and fire away. Of course, you don't use a deemer unless its a wop, so the chances are your gathering resupplys and whatever else you enjoy putting on there. but truly, with the slow fire rate, and the 50/50% that your deemer will actually hit or be shot down, and recapping again, that close quarters can really mess you up.
In my opinion, they are both weapons that require great skill, they have their own catagories of skill, but indeed are weapons which require skill to wield.
Its up to you to decide which one you seem to have more skill for, I, for instance, am more towards the sniper side of combat in most cases and so, i've got a better accuracy rate most like than those who are more fond of being "in the fray" and just hop in and shoot flaks, or combat shotguns(which is why us "snipers" who use weapons as refined as combat shotguns tend to have n ear full of holyshit) and with that better accuracy rate, i have a more precise manuvering when it comes to aiming.
Pksmoka is one such person i can think of that has quite the skill for SSRs.
Von_kill_You seems to be great with redeemer.
Draeghon is better with an ssr i believe.
Angel_dust is more of a deemer type guy....
i'm going to be completely honest now, i forgot what i was talking about halfway typing this. xD
I say they both require skill beyond that of a normal player....heres why.
Super shock rifle - Small AOE, which requires precisional aim. You can run around shootin all you want but your not gonna kill anything unless your aiming for it, aside from titans and queens, and then at long range, even they can prove to be hard to hit. Specially for us who play in 3rd person view. Another note is that you can't vamp, blue, or gold them, so if your wopless, then you have to be on extra alert as far as wands and titans go, and without a Protection 5, on all level players, damage just seems to rack up, killing even the highest lvl of players at times.
While...
Redeemer - requires mainly the skill of staying alive. Sure, you can fire and forget it(assuming you have superforce on) But it can still be shot down. Big or small maps, when surrounded, or not, hitting yourself doesn't feel as good as not vamping either. Not to mention the slow firing rate whether you end up having to continually switch to the redeemer after every fire, or your able to keep it loaded and fire away. Of course, you don't use a deemer unless its a wop, so the chances are your gathering resupplys and whatever else you enjoy putting on there. but truly, with the slow fire rate, and the 50/50% that your deemer will actually hit or be shot down, and recapping again, that close quarters can really mess you up.
In my opinion, they are both weapons that require great skill, they have their own catagories of skill, but indeed are weapons which require skill to wield.
Its up to you to decide which one you seem to have more skill for, I, for instance, am more towards the sniper side of combat in most cases and so, i've got a better accuracy rate most like than those who are more fond of being "in the fray" and just hop in and shoot flaks, or combat shotguns(which is why us "snipers" who use weapons as refined as combat shotguns tend to have n ear full of holyshit) and with that better accuracy rate, i have a more precise manuvering when it comes to aiming.
Pksmoka is one such person i can think of that has quite the skill for SSRs.
Von_kill_You seems to be great with redeemer.
Draeghon is better with an ssr i believe.
Angel_dust is more of a deemer type guy....
i'm going to be completely honest now, i forgot what i was talking about halfway typing this. xD
to master the tact of battle, one must melt and flow like a river with the tides of battle.
well, it seems aurin said much of what i was going to! however, i will word and explain things my way a bit :} oh, and crazybarky, if you have ammo bonus of 100 you get one more redeemer missle to use. if you have 200 ammo bonus (max), you get one more on top of that. so ones with ammo bonus of 200 can resupply to having 3 deemers. thats why deemers professionals like von and diablo shoot two at once most of the time.
my answer to my own question: using both takes skill! i just wanted to see what you guys said. however, in my overall opinion, i believe the super shock requires the most ability in all facets of gameplay.
the redeemer is most likely more fun than most weapons as vonny has stated. its a big blast, looks and feels powerful to have. it is more difficult for most to use because its best potential is has when ammo bonus is 100 or 200, otherwise one has to keep switching weapons. however, i know a few here like caddy who use a primary wep like flak or rl and switch to a resupply deemer every 10 seconds to let one off. this is rather impressive. i cannot do it that well, and i have tried, but i always seem to have a zen ben or such picked up while i run around and screw up my scroll-button weapon switch.
so let's assume someone has a wop deeper with all needed on it and high ammo bonus...every second they shoot out a deemer, and deemers never need to hit on target for it to rape multiple enemies at once. deemers will kill most of the unvampable enemies usually always in one blast, so will super shocks in one shot. now if they let out two redeemers in the same area, they will kill mostly anything but the super tough monsters like lucifers. all the while, if the deemer user is nearby, the heal on the redeemers will heal them through the blast effect time. last i saw yesterday, it seems a redeemer blast self-heals for about 40 hp if 2 heals are on. anyways, such well-configured deemers are lasting big area of effect killers that self heal and are easy to hit monsters with close or far. minimal aim is necessary in both situations and one can be healed. now then, if one is hgih level and last alive, that self healing is nothing compared to hp loss from tough hitting monsters. but one can hide and alt fire it or peek out and fire and be certain to hit something in any case. so a wop deemer in a high ammo bonus user's hand then is not bad to have and overall needs less aiming, less careful movement planning, and a better sense of comfort knowing they will kill something and reduce enemy numbers.
the super shock can be used by anyone with powerful results, so its use is not limited by any stat. just this alone may make it seem like it is a noob weapon (well, i think it is in a way), but it isn't. on non-woppable type super shock maps i often use one for a time until i can get infs for my mp5. and regardless of what weapon i may have or summon, i still use it on army guy waves to get the nice one-hit kills as sometimes can be hard to get in first aimed shot. anyways, the super shock releases 2 shots a second with max weapon speed, while 2 reedemers can fire imemdiately one after another and reload in one second with multiple resupply pus. i suppose this makes them equal in shots per time. however, very precise aim is needed or nothing will die or get damaged. many enemies with small hit boxes and may also move fast can be a pain in the butt to hit. you can't vamp or self heal with a super shock wop (unless you apply a heal turbo laser powerup on and do shock ball stuff or use turbo on enenmies. still, this can take some time whle remaining vulnerable to more damage. also the rare rejuv super shock will vamp at +10). super shock users are subjected to much damage while using and must try to kill what they can before they take too much damage themselves. so in super shock case they must have great aim, good ability to move, and know which enemies to get first that will be the greatest threat. deemer shooters just shoot and get what is in blast radius, often times shooting close to heal.
the other day i saw a player shoot two deemers and kill nearly 15 soldiers at once. try that with a super shock anyhow, i will add this...many super shock maps also have redeemers...now, for a deemer user to outperform most others when so many super shock beams are going, i will defintiely say that is a damn good performance regardless. however, consider someone who summoned or using a normal type super shock that is not a wop. they have no powerups that assist them beside shield and hp regen on other wops...they are more vulnerable than most everyone else. now this is even more impressive if they are doing better in kills and staying alive than the other players.
on a side note, lets not forget some other types of skilled playing. like someone using laser rifle..sure it is strong, but it requires the same aim as super shock and with a rather slow rate of fire than most weapons and like on army guy waves, must always hit on target. those who use normal mini or mp5 wops the whole map and do better than most also deserve praise since these guns lack the base power and require time to kill things that aren't subject to vorpal or other status powerups, especially nalis, smiths, effigies, aliens,and army guys. using a wop flak with no flak type powerups can be included in this. oh, and lets not forget turbo laser users...with how many enemies can completely reflect shock weapons half the time, doing well with one of these is not easy.
i was playing the somewhat small Spirit map earlier today with mp5 the entire time, and i lost and i was actually 3rd place (i know, a rare event :o)! but consider that i was 600 points behind number 1 who had a combat shotgun since wave 5, 200 points behind number 2 who had blast early on as well. it was my best weapon since the rest were negs or crappy weps, and i refuse to suicide to try and get better things. anyhow, i did have an enhanced triple i used wave 17, and it kept up well until 3/4 of the wave in when i wasn't getting kills much and by wave 18 start, it ran out. so wave 18 i focused more on spiders and wave 19 i focused on army guys with low health bars and got adequate kills, and wave 20 went for all enemies subject to vorpal and propulsion effects. so yes, this is the stuff i do when i have a "lesser" weapon. i will focus on killing using methods that maximize the potential of a weapon type, and i consider that map's performance to be an example of gameplay style that involves stategy and skill more than having the best possible weapon than can tear apart anything. this is why i made the strategy posts here on this forum, so you others may understand this game is fun for me because it much more than spamming stuff in the chaos and hoping to kill something!
my answer to my own question: using both takes skill! i just wanted to see what you guys said. however, in my overall opinion, i believe the super shock requires the most ability in all facets of gameplay.
the redeemer is most likely more fun than most weapons as vonny has stated. its a big blast, looks and feels powerful to have. it is more difficult for most to use because its best potential is has when ammo bonus is 100 or 200, otherwise one has to keep switching weapons. however, i know a few here like caddy who use a primary wep like flak or rl and switch to a resupply deemer every 10 seconds to let one off. this is rather impressive. i cannot do it that well, and i have tried, but i always seem to have a zen ben or such picked up while i run around and screw up my scroll-button weapon switch.
so let's assume someone has a wop deeper with all needed on it and high ammo bonus...every second they shoot out a deemer, and deemers never need to hit on target for it to rape multiple enemies at once. deemers will kill most of the unvampable enemies usually always in one blast, so will super shocks in one shot. now if they let out two redeemers in the same area, they will kill mostly anything but the super tough monsters like lucifers. all the while, if the deemer user is nearby, the heal on the redeemers will heal them through the blast effect time. last i saw yesterday, it seems a redeemer blast self-heals for about 40 hp if 2 heals are on. anyways, such well-configured deemers are lasting big area of effect killers that self heal and are easy to hit monsters with close or far. minimal aim is necessary in both situations and one can be healed. now then, if one is hgih level and last alive, that self healing is nothing compared to hp loss from tough hitting monsters. but one can hide and alt fire it or peek out and fire and be certain to hit something in any case. so a wop deemer in a high ammo bonus user's hand then is not bad to have and overall needs less aiming, less careful movement planning, and a better sense of comfort knowing they will kill something and reduce enemy numbers.
the super shock can be used by anyone with powerful results, so its use is not limited by any stat. just this alone may make it seem like it is a noob weapon (well, i think it is in a way), but it isn't. on non-woppable type super shock maps i often use one for a time until i can get infs for my mp5. and regardless of what weapon i may have or summon, i still use it on army guy waves to get the nice one-hit kills as sometimes can be hard to get in first aimed shot. anyways, the super shock releases 2 shots a second with max weapon speed, while 2 reedemers can fire imemdiately one after another and reload in one second with multiple resupply pus. i suppose this makes them equal in shots per time. however, very precise aim is needed or nothing will die or get damaged. many enemies with small hit boxes and may also move fast can be a pain in the butt to hit. you can't vamp or self heal with a super shock wop (unless you apply a heal turbo laser powerup on and do shock ball stuff or use turbo on enenmies. still, this can take some time whle remaining vulnerable to more damage. also the rare rejuv super shock will vamp at +10). super shock users are subjected to much damage while using and must try to kill what they can before they take too much damage themselves. so in super shock case they must have great aim, good ability to move, and know which enemies to get first that will be the greatest threat. deemer shooters just shoot and get what is in blast radius, often times shooting close to heal.
the other day i saw a player shoot two deemers and kill nearly 15 soldiers at once. try that with a super shock
anyhow, i will add this...many super shock maps also have redeemers...now, for a deemer user to outperform most others when so many super shock beams are going, i will defintiely say that is a damn good performance regardless. however, consider someone who summoned or using a normal type super shock that is not a wop. they have no powerups that assist them beside shield and hp regen on other wops...they are more vulnerable than most everyone else. now this is even more impressive if they are doing better in kills and staying alive than the other players.on a side note, lets not forget some other types of skilled playing. like someone using laser rifle..sure it is strong, but it requires the same aim as super shock and with a rather slow rate of fire than most weapons and like on army guy waves, must always hit on target. those who use normal mini or mp5 wops the whole map and do better than most also deserve praise since these guns lack the base power and require time to kill things that aren't subject to vorpal or other status powerups, especially nalis, smiths, effigies, aliens,and army guys. using a wop flak with no flak type powerups can be included in this. oh, and lets not forget turbo laser users...with how many enemies can completely reflect shock weapons half the time, doing well with one of these is not easy.
i was playing the somewhat small Spirit map earlier today with mp5 the entire time, and i lost and i was actually 3rd place (i know, a rare event :o)! but consider that i was 600 points behind number 1 who had a combat shotgun since wave 5, 200 points behind number 2 who had blast early on as well. it was my best weapon since the rest were negs or crappy weps, and i refuse to suicide to try and get better things. anyhow, i did have an enhanced triple i used wave 17, and it kept up well until 3/4 of the wave in when i wasn't getting kills much and by wave 18 start, it ran out. so wave 18 i focused more on spiders and wave 19 i focused on army guys with low health bars and got adequate kills, and wave 20 went for all enemies subject to vorpal and propulsion effects. so yes, this is the stuff i do when i have a "lesser" weapon. i will focus on killing using methods that maximize the potential of a weapon type, and i consider that map's performance to be an example of gameplay style that involves stategy and skill more than having the best possible weapon than can tear apart anything. this is why i made the strategy posts here on this forum, so you others may understand this game is fun for me because it much more than spamming stuff in the chaos and hoping to kill something!
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TheSynGame
- Master Sergeant
- Posts: 823
- Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 3:12 pm
sf kills it. so chances of a deemer getting shot down are VERY low especially when a monster is aiming for you and not the deemer.Aurin wrote:Well, lets go into a bit more details.
I say they both require skill beyond that of a normal player....heres why.
Super shock rifle - Small AOE, which requires precisional aim. You can run around shootin all you want but your not gonna kill anything unless your aiming for it, aside from titans and queens, and then at long range, even they can prove to be hard to hit. Specially for us who play in 3rd person view. Another note is that you can't vamp, blue, or gold them, so if your wopless, then you have to be on extra alert as far as wands and titans go, and without a Protection 5, on all level players, damage just seems to rack up, killing even the highest lvl of players at times.
While...
Redeemer - requires mainly the skill of staying alive. Sure, you can fire and forget it(assuming you have superforce on) But it can still be shot down. Big or small maps, when surrounded, or not, hitting yourself doesn't feel as good as not vamping either. Not to mention the slow firing rate whether you end up having to continually switch to the redeemer after every fire, or your able to keep it loaded and fire away. Of course, you don't use a deemer unless its a wop, so the chances are your gathering resupplys and whatever else you enjoy putting on there. but truly, with the slow fire rate, and the 50/50% that your deemer will actually hit or be shot down, and recapping again, that close quarters can really mess you up.
In my opinion, they are both weapons that require great skill, they have their own catagories of skill, but indeed are weapons which require skill to wield.
Its up to you to decide which one you seem to have more skill for, I, for instance, am more towards the sniper side of combat in most cases and so, i've got a better accuracy rate most like than those who are more fond of being "in the fray" and just hop in and shoot flaks, or combat shotguns(which is why us "snipers" who use weapons as refined as combat shotguns tend to have n ear full of holyshit) and with that better accuracy rate, i have a more precise manuvering when it comes to aiming.
Pksmoka is one such person i can think of that has quite the skill for SSRs.
Von_kill_You seems to be great with redeemer.
Syn is better with an ssr i believe.
Angel_dust is more of a deemer type guy....
i'm going to be completely honest now, i forgot what i was talking about halfway typing this. xD
oh and look at what I edited also.
drae u still owe me and ssr vs. mp5 type of score. I still remember you copped out after u opened crate but I was kickin ya ass. :p
ssr + wand = think of me.