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+SaiN+
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Post by +SaiN+ » Sat May 31, 2008 12:26 am

Here's the problem.

When the Right claims that global warming is a farce, they're partly right.. The average temperature ARE rising, but its not going to turn the planet into the planet Venus. Here in NY we're getting the occasional freaky weather. This winter I recalled that while it did snow, it never stuck. I barely had to break out the shovel and snowplow this year at work, or anywhere!

The bigger concern that rising temperatures may cause is CLIMATE SHIFT. Warm weather doesn't alway come from the sun, it also comes from ocean currents that carry warm water and humidity to certain parts of the world to warm them up during those summer times.. In between the US and Europe for example, there's a circular current of salty water that goes from the equator, past the European states to warm their country, and back down again as it reaches as high as the north pole, and circulates down again to the equator. As the polar ice caps melt and introduce fresh water into that circular system, its being disturbed. Eventually that system may end up being halted, and the winter chill of the north pole may end up spreading further down as far as the UK, European countries and even spots like NYC, where those places will look constantly snowy and VERY cold like Siberian-style stuff.

I've seen some Americans 'protest' the global warming crowd by buying bigger trucks, SUVs and making smog machines to "stick it to the hippies", but little they know, those "hippie scientists" are going to end up having the last laugh. |-(

While I understand that things take time, people who refuse to acknowledge that SOMETHING is up-- Cimate-wise, corporate-wise, political-wise -- and completely deny it and listen to their people and just DON'T QUESTION, are the ones that bug me.

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Post by Archangel » Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:00 pm

Here's where the young people have to realize the life is fluid, cyclic and ever changing. Forget all the doom and gloom.
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Post by hwsb » Mon Jun 02, 2008 11:17 am

Archangel wrote:Here's where the young people have to realize the life is fluid, cyclic and ever changing. Forget all the doom and gloom.
and here's what the boomer generation needs to realize: we (people) can't just do what we want. you may choose to bury your head in the sand, that is your right. the rest of us are at least willing to explore the possibility of there being some truth to climate change, as well as taking responsibility for our involvement in it. believing that all the carbon that we release into the atmosphere (that has been sequestered in the ground) has no ill effect is most certainly burying your head in the sand.


the same type of bullshit was spewed about the hole in the ozone layer. things like "we are powerless to do anything about it, so why worry?" and "we can't possibly be having any effect, it's all good" were argued.


this is hardly about doom & gloom, it's about taking responsibility.

p.s. no offense arch, you know i like your buttsex :D

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Post by Archangel » Mon Jun 02, 2008 6:45 pm

How long have you been on this earth?.......You must think that I haven't experienced a few things in my life time. In the early 70's, they were predicting we'd be out of oil by now...........We now know what happened there..........I don't live life with blinders on.......I'm a realist........I don't buy into ALL the BS that alot of people put out. Certain groups have been known to put a "SLANT" on the info........

EDIT: I only like my "buttsex" with my wife.......Thank you very much!!! hmm
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Post by hwsb » Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:18 pm

Archangel wrote:How long have you been on this earth?.......You must think that I haven't experienced a few things in my life time. In the early 70's, they were predicting we'd be out of oil by now...........We now know what happened there..........I don't live life with blinders on.......I'm a realist........I don't buy into ALL the BS that alot of people put out. Certain groups have been known to put a "SLANT" on the info........
oh, so we're the ones wearing blinders? absurd. you just said yourself that there's no need to worry, just do what you want. you call that 'taking off the blinders'?

you just keep on keepin on, doing whatever the fvck you want and explaining it away with "well, we haven't broken it yet, so we probably won't and there's no point in dwelling on it". everyone else who is at least willing to examine the impact they have on their surroundings will continue to do so, no matter how loud you scream 'EVERYTHING IS FINE'.

i've been on this planet for 27 years. you said you've been here for more than fifty. you also said that in your lifetime you've seen crisis, real or imagined, come and go. can you seriously claim that there is no merit to the raw data that's being collected? the thousands of years back that scientists are able to measure carbon levels, which show CO2 today at a high that was never before encountered while humans existed?


edit: i had to re-quote this:
Certain groups have been known to put a "SLANT" on the info........
indeed. reality has a well-known liberal bias. --stephen colbert
EDIT: I only like my "buttsex" with my wife.......Thank you very much!!! hmm
scurrilous lies :D

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Post by Archangel » Tue Jun 03, 2008 2:18 am

First...get your censored facts straight hwsb.....I stated I've been on this earth "ALMOST" 50 years.....not over.

Second....I don't stick my head in the sand as you suggest and ignore what's going on.......Let me ask you this......Were you down in New Orleans after Katrina hit helping?......I was for almost 2 years, dodging bullets, protecting Red Cross and FEMA personnel.......Sounds like you like to run your mouth like you know all the answers but don't want to actively participate in helping out. I'd really like to see how you'd react in a REAL hostile situation.....Your last post sounds like your a 27 yr. old immature punk.

Third........Read all your post and the hostility it puts out towards my posts. This thread wasn't about that.
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Post by hwsb » Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:06 am

Archangel wrote:First...get your censored facts straight hwsb.....I stated I've been on this earth "ALMOST" 50 years.....not over.
ok. sorry about getting your age wrong, does it really make that big a difference? you were the one claiming that your superior age made you wiser, after all.
Second....I don't stick my head in the sand as you suggest and ignore what's going on.......
neither do i. that's why i took umbrage at your 'blinders' comment.
Let me ask you this......Were you down in New Orleans after Katrina hit helping?......I was for almost 2 years, dodging bullets, protecting Red Cross and FEMA personnel.......
nope, i sure wasn't. wtf does that have to do with anything? btw you were there with what, the coast guard? good for you. seriously, i'm not being sarcastic, good for you.
Sounds like you like to run your mouth like you know all the answers but don't want to actively participate in helping out.
run my mouth? most definitely. have all the answers? not in the slightest. see, that's what the difference is between our previous posts: you proclaimed that it's all bullshit, and i proclaimed that maybe we should take a deeper look at the issues at hand. so now you brand me as someone who "doesn't want to participate in actively helping out", and go into a tirade about how you did this & that in katrina. nice, way to address the points i raised, by placing blame and deflecting the subject.
I'd really like to see how you'd react in a REAL hostile situation.....Your last post sounds like your a 27 yr. old immature punk.
hell, _i'd_ like to see how i'd react in a REAL hostile situation. i mean, i've been in fistfights, gotten my face smashed a few times, but i've never been in full-on combat. i've wondered about that for quite a few years now. so anyways, call me what you will, but in the end you're still just ignoring the questions i've posed.
Third........Read all your post and the hostility it puts out towards my posts. This thread wasn't about that.
look, i am sorry if i come across as directly hostile towards you. apparently i tend to be incredibly abrasive towards the individuals i'm speaking to, instead of the topic i'm speaking of. i've never had a problem with you before, archangel, and i still don't.

and to your point on this thread, Big_Meat said it much more politely in his last paragraph than i did in my rant... so yeah. _you_ read all of the posts.

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Post by +SaiN+ » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:40 pm

People normally won't change their ways in life until they finally see that "smoking gun" proof that they need. Arch's probably been through the gas crisis around the 70s (80s?) and the like.

Oil reserve predictions would definitely be off but as technology improves, we could perhaps get more accurate numbers. The more pricey oil gets, the more smaller countries would suffer and possibly, collapse and trigger waves of refugees and population displacement.

While Arch's services are to be commended, I still don't think its an issue that's to be ignored. People thought the ozone would be fine in the past. Then an ozone hole was torn open over the Antarctic around the 90s (if my history is correct), prompting the crackdown of aerosol in spray-cans, more environmentally friendly cooling systems, etc.. Smaller occurrences have been happening due to climate changes--

The honey-bee population here in my local area, for example is near -absent- ... They, and colonial/roost animals and insects that hibernate in the winter have been suffering attacks of a new, unknown fungus (or disease, scientists aren't certain) that kills the animals as they hibernate. Microchirpteran (bats) population have suffered as low as ~78% - upto a 98-100% (!!!!) death-rate because of the early onset of warm temperatures and earlier springs, the animals' sensory of the seasons out of whack, moist and dark torpor / hibernation caves that are killing HUGE population of bats, and bees and thus, causing the insect pest populations that these animals feed upon to florish. Not to mention the lack of pollination bees help in.

Animals that normally stay south are moving up. Animals like armadillos in wierd places.. You get the picture. The climate IMO is a very, VERY delicate system. It takes but a small bit of degrees to change the world.

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Post by Archangel » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:25 pm

+SaiN+ wrote:People normally won't change their ways in life until they finally see that "smoking gun" proof that they need. Arch's probably been through the gas crisis around the 70s (80s?) and the like.

Oil reserve predictions would definitely be off but as technology improves, we could perhaps get more accurate numbers. The more pricey oil gets, the more smaller countries would suffer and possibly, collapse and trigger waves of refugees and population displacement.

While Arch's services are to be commended, I still don't think its an issue that's to be ignored. People thought the ozone would be fine in the past. Then an ozone hole was torn open over the Antarctic around the 90s (if my history is correct), prompting the crackdown of aerosol in spray-cans, more environmentally friendly cooling systems, etc.. Smaller occurrences have been happening due to climate changes--

The honey-bee population here in my local area, for example is near -absent- ... They, and colonial/roost animals and insects that hibernate in the winter have been suffering attacks of a new, unknown fungus (or disease, scientists aren't certain) that kills the animals as they hibernate. Microchirpteran (bats) population have suffered as low as ~78% - upto a 98-100% (!!!!) death-rate because of the early onset of warm temperatures and earlier springs, the animals' sensory of the seasons out of whack, moist and dark torpor / hibernation caves that are killing HUGE population of bats, and bees and thus, causing the insect pest populations that these animals feed upon to florish. Not to mention the lack of pollination bees help in.

Animals that normally stay south are moving up. Animals like armadillos in wierd places.. You get the picture. The climate IMO is a very, VERY delicate system. It takes but a small bit of degrees to change the world.
You want bees.........come down here to Georgia

You want bats..........come down here to Georgia

Take em home with you..............We have em so bad down here it's not even funny.

As far as armadillos ..........they breed like rats and with cities expanding on a daily rate, they will move north.........damn things mess up your car when you hit em.........I hit one in NOLA with a rental KIA and tore the whole front fascia off........thought I hit a rock til I saw the huge blood spot on the road.

As far as climates go........some winters are just warmer than others......My brother said they had a real bad winter up in Michigan.
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Post by TheMadDJ » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:14 am

First. Global warming is NOT a new "challenge". We've known and studied it for over twenty years. Yep. We've been ignoring it for 15 years. No matter how many beer cans you've recycled this morning, the damage has been done. However, the media jumping on it "THE END IS NIGH" placards held high are blowing the whole topic out of proportion.

Second. While being the English git that I am means that I don't know anything about the Dollar being piss weak recently, but I'm pretty sure you'll need a LOT more than a revival in the Coal Trade.

Lastly. There are multiple factors controlling the price of fuel ATM. One of them is the wars that the UK and the US are currently waging in the Middle East. Another would be Russia controlling the export of oil out of Asia. So, Supplies are being diverted to aid the war effort, so the price goes up to level it out.

Long story short. This hasn't got ANYTHING to do with global warming. At least not to the extent you guys are ripping limbs off each other for.
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